Evolution, Science, and God

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Ken Ham takes us on a tour of the Creation Museum in Petersburg, Kentucky.

 

 

okay, Back in the 1980s there were a couple of very popular television programs that dominated the airwaves. One of them was called Ripley’s believe it or not. The other one was called. That’s incredible. And basically the programs dealt with things that were nearly impossible. Well after today’s program, you may maybe tell us that we should perhaps think about changing our title to match those genres because we’re doing something that’s nearly impossible. We started first with an arab and a jew co hosting a program together, but today we’ve managed to get an Australian and a new Zealander. Yes. Friends, a kiwi and an Aussie to sit down together and to talk and today we’re gonna deal with matters of eternal consequence. Like what is better kiwi birds or kangaroos, marmite or vegemite. And was that under Armed Bull in 1981 justified? We’re gonna find out today because we have with us Ray comfort and our special guest mr ken, ham. Now ken, do I have this right, President? No, no. Founder and ceo of a I. G. The ark encounter and the creation museum, is that right? Yeah, they give you 10 out of 10. You got it. Got it. So how about that Under Armed Bowl. Don’t bring that up. Just when Harmony was flown in the Oh yeah right. That almost caused world War three back in the day. Well ken it’s so good to have you with us today. Obviously a I g living Waters, we have been Friends for many, many years millions, millions. Yes, it seems like the relationship is is evolving right? It just seems like feels that way never ending. And it’s been a joy not only because we’re like minded when it comes to the authority of scripture and the accounts that matter in connection with our faith in genesis, but because we’ve been able to work together on the common goal of the Gospel and getting that out, which is what it’s all about. Exactly. It all comes back to that. So let’s kick things off with talking about what you specialize in. Of course the whole what is called the theory of evolution and for those of you that are watching if you grew up in the United States of America. Well you’ve obviously been schooled in evolution if you went to public school and of course secular universities but can they call it the theory of evolution? And it’s taught as fact uh what do you have to say about that? Well, first of all it’s not a theory and it’s not a fact. You know, it’s interesting there are many christians that say oh they need to make sure they tell students it’s only a theory or you know make sure your teacher knows it’s only a theory. Well actually theory is not the right word for evolution because if you look up the definition of a theory what it means to be a theory, it means that there is scientific evidence to support it. There is no scientific evidence to support the idea of evolution. Notice I said idea it’s a belief you see when you’re talking about molecules demand and actually you know evolutionists will claim our evolutions that got nothing to do with the original life. It’s got everything to do with the original life. Darwin even talked about that in his book because if you can’t explain where life came in the first place and you can’t explain how matter can produce information. Like you see in D. N. A. And the language system you can’t explain anything at all. And it does include how life arose supposedly from matter by itself by natural processes. And then over millions of years supposedly you have one kind of animal changing into a totally different kind new features that weren’t potentially possible before now become possible because there’s new information in the genes. I mean it’s a belief that’s what it is and I would call it a blind faith belief because there is no evidence for the belief in evolution. It’s a belief that they apply to the evidence to try to explain what you actually have. And so it’s not fact it’s not theory. It’s really a religion actually I call if you want me to really tell tell it like it is you said religion, evolution is a religion. It’s it’s a pagan religion of our age to try to explain life without God. I mean if you look up the definition of religion and you look up the Merriam Webster dictionary for instance. You know, for any word, there are some, they have some different definitions if you like. Well, one of the definitions of religion is a system concept, a system of belief held to with ardor and faith, what is evolution? It’s a concept, a system of belief held to with Ardor and faith, Although it’s not just ordinary faith is not faith, like a christian has its blind faith. In fact it lacks credulity. It’s best buy Of saying it. Yeah, well, can I remember when you debated bill nine and you brought out the different elements that that show really that that’s what’s going on. It’s a it’s a faith issue. But I think secularist hearing you say that today would uh would blow up with anger and rage and Ray, they even have their profits. They’ve got Dawkins et cetera. And then you’ve got their holy book origin of species, which we did to put an introduction in their holy book and they went was the high priest. Yeah, probably right. Actually, The evolution, the Atheist go berserk on my twitter and facebook when I say evolution is religion or Atheism is a religion and they say Atheism is a non belief. Well, Atheism is a belief, they have a belief that everything arose by natural processes. That’s their belief. They can’t scientifically prove that it’s a religion and evolution is really there supposed scientific justification for their Atheism, it’s their theology, it is a doctrine. And you know, I say supposed scientific justification because that’s one of the other things I did with Bill and I was to say, okay, your claiming science has disproved the bible and if Children are taught creation, then they’re gonna give up science and it’ll destroy technology. So we, first of all have to even define what the word science means. The word Science means knowledge and it comes from the latin ciencia, which means knowledge and there’s different sorts of knowledge. You can have knowledge about the present that builds a technology like these cameras here based on using your five senses observation, repeatedly testing. That’s how we build jet airplanes. That’s how we build iphones and Androids. I think Androids came about by chance, but because I was so, but that’s, that’s observational science. But then when it comes to talking about beliefs about the past, the origin of life, when you weren’t there to see it, that’s called historical science. And there, there is an important point here that everyone needs to distinguish between historical science and observational science example. I gave Bill Nye, go to the Grand Canyon, we can say, oh, there’s a canyon. We both agree, Oh look at the rock layers. We both agree, oh look at this sandstone, we can agree on that because we know what the definition of sandstone is. We can measure it and say it’s so many feet thick, we can measure the size of the grains. We can measure the angle at which the grains are deposited. We can all agree on that. And then Bill, nye will say, But it was laid down over millions of years and I’ll say no, it was laid down catastrophically during the flood. Suddenly we disagree. What’s the difference? While all the things we could agree on, you can observe test, repeat measure in the present. What we disagreed on was a belief about the past when we weren’t there dealing with the origins issue. Right? And we we’ve often talked about that mark. I’d love you to touch on that. It’s it’s the interpretive lenses. We all have the same information we’re working with. But it’s that that presupposition that really is the catalyst for how we look at it. Yeah, well, we start with the presupposition that the bible is God’s word. And from there, everything we believe goes out from there. Now, I I readily admit that. I readily agree with that. Now, an atheist is gonna come along and evolutionist is gonna come along and that is not their position. They do not adhere to that. They have this worldview in which they are autonomous. Everything is subjective. They get to decide. They are the captain of their own destiny. We all have a worldview, every single one of us. Now, we interpret it through a biblical lens. And from that, we are able to make sense of science. We’re able to make sense of the things that are happening around us, ken nailed it. It’s blind faith. When you grab ahold of an evolutionary worldview, it’s, it’s like, hey, I’m gonna walk down this alley and I hope I make it to the other side if there’s nothing substantial to it, right? We, we think we as christians, we know that the future is going to be like the past because there’s this uniformity of nature, Right? We, we, we have this. But within an evolutionary worldview, they cannot make sense of that. They don’t know that the future is going to be like the past, Right? I mean, how do I know I’m gonna die? I’ve never died before, Right. I mean, since I’ve never died before, that’s not to say that I won’t die. You’re grasping for straws. When you adhere to an evolutionary worldview, you know, Ray, you’ve been dealing with evolutionists forever in the sense that when you go open air preach it’s common that that objection comes up and ken, I’d like you to talk to that in a second. But what do you do with that ray? You’re standing on a soapbox, you’re proclaiming the gospel and someone says, I don’t believe in God. It’s all about evolution. How do you deal with that? I used it to draw a crowd because I know the motive behind someone who believes his blind faith and evolutionists, they love their sins. They deny the existence of God the, the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made therefore they’re without excuse. So all this is, is a smoke screen so they can carry on with their fornication, pornography, lying, stealing, lusting. And uh, and so I talked to the intellect for a while and then I deliberately go to the conscience because my agenda is not to convert him to creationism. I wanted to convert them to christ, I wanted to find everlasting life that um, comes his, his theology will come correct once he is safe, once God opens the eyes of his understanding. Right? So ken how do you deal with that? People using evolution as sort of a smokescreen to reject Christianity? Well, you know, it’s interesting if you’ve ever heard of Eugene scott. She lived here in California, headed up an organization called the N. C S. C, which is basically an organization to try to stop students in schools even hearing about creation. Anyway, she came out when we opened the Creation Museum and was contracted to the BBC and she came out to interview me and so she said in my office and she said, you start with the bible. I said yes, that’s correct. She said, well, I’m a real scientist. Scientist start from evidence and from evidence, we develop our theories and so on. And I said, oh yeah, she said you start with the bible. And she said, uh, you’re not prepared to question what the bible states are. And I said no. And she said, see, she said, we start with evidence, whereas you start with the bible. And she said, your views are already set. And I said, well, what what the bible says has already said. She said, so, you’re not prepared to change? And I said, not prepared to change what’s in the bible, Right? And then she said to me, see, she said, that’s religion. Your views are set. You start with the bible, we’re scientists, we start with evidence. So I said dr scott. I said, now you’re an atheist. You say that, right? She said, yes, you don’t believe in God. That’s right. You don’t believe the bible is true. No, you’re not even prepared to uh, look at the possibility that genesis could be true. And she says no. So you’re not. So you start with that belief. You know, you’re not prepared to question that, are you? And what I was really showing violence. I start with the bible, Yes, But you start with the belief. The bible is not true. You start with the belief that everything happened by natural processes. So, you have a religion. And one of the things I’ve found is very important for them to understand is that it’s it’s their foundational belief that determines their worldview. So that’s why when I was taking Bill, and I threw the arc on what we call the second debate, and I kept trying to push him to the logical consequences of the foundation that he has. So Bill, what happens when you die, when you die? You’re done? Well, if when you die you’re done, then what’s the use of trying to fight people like us? And, you know, it means ultimately life is meaningless and purposeless? And he said, I know, because while we’re here, we needed all these great things to help people. What’s the point of that? And they will die and then they’re done and they won’t even remember they were ever here and you won’t even remember you were ever here. So what’s the point of it? All right? So, what you’re gonna do is push them to the logical consequence, the logical conclusion of their foundation and their worldview. And, you know, if there’s no God, then who decides right and wrong? I mean, I asked Bill, nye, that had you decide right and wrong, he said, it’s by consensus of the tribe, I said, but what if your tribe has a different consensus and another tribe? Well, that’s true? Well, what if someone says we’re going to shoot you because we consider you’re dangerous, can they do that? He says, well, it depends. And so then all is relative, it’s the same for marriage. You know, if there’s no God, that the bible is not true there’s no such thing as marriage, you can do whatever you want, ultimately anything goes. And really, if you wanted to sum up what evolution is all about, ultimately, and it’s really what Ray said there earlier, but I’ll sum it up with a verse of scripture, Judges 21 25 when there’s no king to tell them what to do, no absolute authority, everyone does what is right in his own eyes. That’s what we see, permeating our culture right now, because we’ve had generations indoctrinated in evolutionary atheism through our school system and now we’re seeing the consequences and that and that their worldview comes out of the foundation that man determines truth or whatever truth is, and it’s all relative and it’s whatever you what you want, truth to be for you, ultimately. Anything goes there in lies, the problem so true. And look, you’ve heard it said, of course, ideas have consequences and in this case, major ones, but ken, I love what you shared about the response of Bill Nye and dr scott. And the reason why I think they’re silenced is because they’re not used to someone challenging them, winsome lee in that way. You know, a lot of the arguments we see today out in the world are pathetic, honestly, coming from the christian world. So that’s why we love answers in genesis and that’s why we’re excited about what you guys are doing now, I came out to the Creation Museum not long ago, I spent some time with you there, we’re going to play that video now. But ken, let me just say before we play it. That the one thing that has thrilled me about what you guys do is you do it with excellent and you do it under the glory of whatever you do do is under the Lord. My father always taught me that that’s what the scripture says. Why shouldn’t we as christians be as good as or better in the world? Because after all, we have got the most important message of all time. Amen. Alright friends. Well now you’re gonna see that excellence that I was talking about as you see this tour of the Creation Museum. You know, I’ve been to a lot of places in the past 18 years of my life on this earth. But I have to say I’m at one of my favorite places in the world today. The Creation Museum. I mean, can you believe it? An actual Creation museum? Atheists and evolutionists love it. Come with me, check it out. Oh look who’s here? The world’s favorite Aussie Easy. How you doing? It’s about time you came here millions of years for you to get here. It was a process of evolution. But finally, I made it in full for let me tell you this ken, I’ve been to the Creation Museum before and I want our friends to watch the program to see it as well. So you show us around. Absolutely. Right. Let’s go for a walk here and show you something really exciting. Yeah. See all these fossils here. I mean we have real fossils in glass cases here. The Atheists really upset at that. They don’t want us to have real fossils. They think they own them. It’s like dinosaurs are really upset that we talk about dinosaurs. They think that they own the dinosaurs and everything. We have no right to use those for creation and for telling people the truth about God’s word. But you know what we’ve heard over and over again even from there’s been some uh you know well known evolutionary scientists who have come through here as well. And one of the things that we’ve heard back and they’ve even written in their books they mock our message and say how ridiculous. And then they say but one can’t but admire how well done it is. In fact some of them are saying wow it’s so well done. People are gonna believe it. You know they don’t like that. They don’t like that we do it in such a first class professional way. So you know I’ve been to the museums in Dc and honestly most of them can’t even compare to what you have here. We have a lot of families who say oh we went to the Smithsonian in Washington D. C. And the kids say but this is far better. Absolutely show me around a little more. Let’s go and have a look. So let me ask you this about dinosaurs. I think that evolutionists have this perception that it’s the christians, achilles heel that come on, answer the question about how dinosaurs could have existed with man. That’s impossible. Right? Here’s an interesting thing you’ve ever been to Ripley’s aquarium in Gatlinburg or even go to Newport aquarium here in our area. You’ll see living horseshoe crabs. And at the Ripley’s aquarium they have a big sign saying living fossils, horseshoe crabs lived a million 100 million years before dinosaurs lived with dinosaurs. And here they are living today beside us. So here you have a creature that supposedly evolved way before dinosaurs live with dinosaurs. It’s living today live besides people. But it’s silly to believe that humans and dinosaurs lived at the same time. This is fascinating and great craftsmanship. I think you told me Buddy Davis sculpted but he sculpted the dinosaurs that you see in this particular exhibit. And so the sculptures just artistic license applied to the bones. We found the eggs by the way, are real, real fossil. So ken we’re looking here at grandma lucy. This is one of the most famous supposed missing links. So this is this is a trophy of evolutionists. It’s interesting, you know, the arm bones and the leg bones were broken and of course they they want lucy to be human like. So they don’t want lucy to have long arms. So they shorten where the break is. They shorten that length there and with the leg bones, they don’t want to have the short legs like an eight. So they lengthen it. And actually where you look, where they’re broken, the opposite is the best fit actually. And so there’s many other things that we look at here and show people that overwhelmingly this is some sort of extinct date. You know, ken, I’m not exaggerating in the least bit. When I say, I could literally spend days in this place and it’s not just because you have things to look at, but there’s so much to read. There’s information everywhere. And I know that this is a centerpiece here, tell us about it. Well, we’re in the biblical authority room and this really sums up what the whole ministry of answers in genesis, the Creation museum, the ark encounter really why we exist, what it’s all about. You see the attack today, the genesis three attack today is particularly leveled at genesis 1 to 11. Much of the church’s succumbed and said, it doesn’t matter. We don’t need genesis, we can believe a millions years as long as you trust in jesus. But you see the issue is the message of jesus comes from a book and if you’ve undermined the authority of that book, that word to coming generations, They’re not going to believe the rest of the message. There’s a lack of apologetics teaching in our churches, in our homes and that’s why the Lord is raised up organizations like answers and genesis living waters to be able to give that apologetics teaching so that we can equip people to be able to defend the christian faith and answer this because the skeptical questions of this age. Yeah. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. You know, ken we talked earlier about your parents and the foundation that they laid in your life and how really it’s led to all of this. I love the fact that you’ve got a visual aid to help us capture that. Tell us about your favorite exhibit. It’s only small exhibit but is my favorite and when people stand in front of here, I want them to think of one word legacy. What legacy are you living in this world? What legacy are you passing on to your Children? Because this is a little nose argued. My father built me many many years ago and not knowing would one day build a life size are, here’s his bible with his notes in there. My father went to be with the Lord about 22 years ago and really the ministry of answers in genesis Creation museum. The ark encounter is a legacy of parents who taught their Children to stand boldly uncompromisingly on the authority of the word of God and to preach the gospel of jesus christ and what this is saying is this, that’s the legacy they passed on to us. What legacy are you passing on to your Children. Amen, it’s no small thing to bring up a generation for the glory of God. If your dad could have seen all this, wow, he sowed the seeds that have borne fruit. Absolutely, yes, ken it was great watching that again. You know, I’ve been at the Creation Museum a number of times and it never gets old for me. And in fact, the biggest problem of going to the museum is one day just isn’t enough. So where did the vision come from and what’s the impact been so far through it? You know, the vision really goes back to 1975 And actually, in a sense, from my childhood, because of the way my parents brought me up. But in 1975 I became a size teacher in the public schools in Australia. And the first science lesson that I taught students was a christian because Australia is a very pagan country and sort of more like England, the number of people who go to church. I mean the only country I know that would be even less pagan in Australia with the true original pagans. But the first science class I taught students said to me sir, we heard you’re a christian because I was gonna be running the christian group in the school. But how can you be a christian when we know the bible is not true. I said, you know, the bible is not true because of what our textbook teaches about evolution. One of the students said so, but no one could have fed all the animals on the ark. And so I started to teach them about creation and the flood and the Tower of Babel and so on without getting into trouble. You know in those days it wasn’t a problem at all you know today. Yeah, if things are very, very different but I shared that with them and then I started speaking in some churches and bible studies. But then I started taking students to museums and I taught in a number of different high schools in Australia and always took them to museums. Always wanted to help, you know, things come alive for them in that sense instead of just Looking at textbooks in the classroom, but they were always from a theistic evolutionist perspective. And the Lord gave me a burden during that time. Why can’t we build a creation museum? And actually in 1980, I left school teacher to go full time in the creation apologetics ministry that started in our home in Brisbane Australia. But in 1981 of the board members who helped to start the ministry, he and I stood on a piece of property in Australia and prayed that the Lord would allow us to build a creation museum. And the Lord answered that prayer but not in our time and not in the way we thought it was many years later through all sorts of circumstances and really Australia is not the best place for it because America’s the center of the business world, the center of the christian world has a much bigger christian population, a much bigger philanthropic base to be able to build a facility like that. And eventually the ark encounter as well. And one of the, one of the things that I’ve heard over and over and over again from people who go through the Creation Museum, from parents, particularly in regard to their kids, it helps make the bible come alive. It’s a different way of presenting the Gospel. You know, you can preach the Gospel in churches, you can do it in all sorts of different ways. You can preach it out, you know, on the beach, you can use movies, but you can also use themed attractions. And so it’s a different way of presenting the Gospel to a culture that increasingly won’t go to church. Only 18% of millennials go to church. And so what we did with the Creation Museum, it’s actually a walk through the bible called the Seven Seas of History using life size exhibits, answering the skeptical questions that cause people to doubt the bible is true. And if you want the message in a nutshell is this, We use these life size exhibits, planetarium, 40, theatre gardens, zoo, petting zoo and so on. But we give this message, the history of the bible is true. That’s why the Gospel based in that history is true. That’s it in a nutshell. Amen. And the excellence that you see just evident throughout the entire thing. As I said in the video, that’s what blows me away. And to think about what happened, you referenced your parents again. What happened with what took place in your home and now you think about the millions of people combined between the ark and the creation museum that have been impacted by the truth. That that is just phenomenal real quick cause we’re almost out of time. But how many people would you say have gone now through the museum and the ark combined through the museum and the art combined. If you added the numbers together, it’s probably up over six million. Six million. Now, I’ve got a dumb question, do you allow blind people through the museum where they’re seeing eye dogs, all those bones around. Absolutely, absolutely, Yeah. They’ll never let you have it. Actually. We do have special tactile experiences for those who do have a problem with eyesight and we have a special death day. We we actually reach out. We actually built a big new playground for Children that allows Children with disabilities to be able to get on many of I love it. And and and so much more so friends if you haven’t been there and make sure to check it out. Thanks for joining us today on way of The Master. We’ll see you next time. We hope this episode of Wave, the Master has inspired you to share the message of eternal life. You can watch our award winning movies, such as the Atheist Delusion freely on our website, where you’ll also find articles, videos, and audio messages, as well as books, Dvds, Gospel tracks and other resources to help you share your faith biblically, and effectively make sure to visit Living Waters dot com today.

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